AA regional jet - Blackhawk midair - Washington DC - 29 Jan 2025

[PeterNSteinmetz]

Wow. No news yet on casualties.

Passenger jet collides with Army helicopter while landing at Reagan Washington National Airport

A passenger jet has collided with an Army helicopter while landing at Ronald Reagan National Airport near Washington.

apnews.com

 

[Winthrop]

I would be very surprised if that helicopter was actually being operated by the US Army. Though this just goes to show that governments are now a serious danger to civil aircraft.

 

[Winthrop]

 

[anonflyer1]

I would be very surprised if that helicopter was actually being operated by the US Army.

It was an UH60 of the 12th AVB out of Ft. Belvoir. They routinely fly and handle gov't VIP travel needs in the DC area. The callsign used by the accident helicopter is one used by that unit.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

Blancolirio channel with more information about the courses and airspace

 

[Winthrop]

It was an UH60 of the 12th AVB out of Ft. Belvoir. They routinely fly and handle gov't VIP travel needs in the DC area. The callsign used by the accident helicopter is one used by that unit.

I used to live in DC. Lot's of other agencies use that callsign too.

 

[Winthrop]

Granted I lived there a long time ago, so perhaps things have changed. But all I said is I would be surprised. At the very least this was not a typical UH-60 flight operated by the Army.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

I think they should just decongest that airspace by eliminating these VIP flights. These politicians are very replaceable and they just aren’t really that important. Additionally, they can spend the extra 20 minutes working in the back of their limos in traffic.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

Crew of the helicopter now identified - https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2025/01/black-hawk-helicopter-pilot-killed-d-c-tragedy/

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

Helicopter crew wearing night vision goggles on an annual night flight check - https://asn.flightsafety.org/wikibase/474365

 

[Winthrop]

I think they should just decongest that airspace by eliminating these VIP flights. These politicians are very replaceable and they just aren’t really that important. Additionally, they can spend the extra 20 minutes working in the back of their limos in traffic.

You expect the junior under secretary of education to travel by armored car like some state senator?

Also, they don't work.

 

[anonflyer1]

At the very least this was not a typical UH-60 flight operated by the Army.

That unit also operates VH-60 models which are the shiny, gold top 60s you would have seen flying those same routes on a very regular basis. The VH-60 main mission is to transport VIPs for the DoD when required and the UH 60 are used for training like in this flight and other support roles. They are also tasked to provide emergency evac for the Pentagon should the need arise. A good friend of mine flew crew chief and was a mx chief for this unit.

These politicians are very replaceable and they just aren’t really that important.

No politicians use these aircraft as noted above.

 

[Winthrop]

No politicians use these aircraft as noted above.

Really, how are you defining a politician?

 

[Winthrop]

I find it interesting that the Army is refusing to disclose who the pilot in command was. I assume the third person was the PIC as they noted a captain, a chief warrant officer and a sergeant. Though maybe they meant captain generically as opposed to O-3?

https://www.npr.org/2025/01/30/nx-s1-5281246/pentagon-jet-military-helicopter-collision

It is interesting that the co-pilot had more than 1,000 hours of flight time while the PIC has only 500 hours.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

The NYT wants to emphasize system problems per the headline. But given the existing information this looks like a failure to see and avoid by the Heli PIC as primary cause.

And yes, who was the PIC?

https://archive.ph/85hqU

 

[anonflyer1]

Really, how are you defining a politician?

An elected official who creates and manages public policy.

I find it interesting that the Army is refusing to disclose who the pilot in command was. I assume the third person was the PIC as they noted a captain, a chief warrant officer and a sergeant.

I believe the reason the 3rd person has not been ID’d was at the request of her family. So no mystery. But for reference, the aircraft commander (PIC) was the Chief Warrant Officer and the Sgt was the crew chief. Warrant Officers have been aircraft commanders since Vietnam which was the reason the WO rank was created in the first place.

But given the existing information this looks like a failure to see and avoid by the Heli PIC as primary cause.

The latest “guess” is once indicating they (PAT25) had traffic (AA) in sight, the ATC commanded maintain visual separation and proceed. The problem is they may have been looking at a different aircraft.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

An elected official who creates and manages public

Merriam-Webster gives “

politician​

noun​

pol·i·ti·cian ˌpä-lə-ˈti-shən

1
: a person experienced in the art or science of government
especially : one actively engaged in conducting the business of a government

2
a
: a person engaged in party politics as a profession
b
often disparaging : a person primarily interested in political office for selfish or other narrow usually short-sighted reasons”

I think definition 1 would include most high level government officials of the sort who fly around in helicopters at taxpayer expense.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

I believe the reason the 3rd person has not been ID’d was at the request of her family. So no mystery.

Do governments employees generally have these sort of privacy rights? I mean you chose to work for the government. I think your identity, position. salary, and all official communications should be a matter of public record, unless appropriately classified.

 

[Winthrop]

An elected official who creates and manages public policy.

I believe the reason the 3rd person has not been ID’d was at the request of her family. So no mystery. But for reference, the aircraft commander (PIC) was the Chief Warrant Officer and the Sgt was the crew chief. Warrant Officers have been aircraft commanders since Vietnam which was the reason the WO rank was created in the first place.

The latest “guess” is once indicating they (PAT25) had traffic (AA) in sight, the ATC commanded maintain visual separation and proceed. The problem is they may have been looking at a different aircraft.

My understanding had been that warrant officers were created by the English Royal Navy in the 13th century. As to flying, I think you could argue that during World War II, pilots in the US Army Air Forces who held the rank equivalent to a warrant officer were called "Flight Officers," meaning that while not technically commissioned officers, they were considered warrant officers in terms of rank. I seem to recall that the USAF discontinued that practice after World War 2. The USN if memory serves had enlisted pilots up until 1981. Though most of my history of this dates back to ROTC which was long long ago.

As to a politician, you would not consider secretaries to be politicians because they are not elected?

Also, it appears the person flying was a student with some 500 hours. Per an article in the Guardian: "the . . . instructor pilot had more than 1,000 hours of flight time, the female pilot who was commanding the flight at the time had more than 500 hours of flight time . . ." See, https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...-say?page=with:block-679d56818f083390b0b97c59

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

It also appears the helicopter was flying off the approved route. Too far west and 100’ high. Evidently if they had been on the approved route they would not have struck this aircraft on its final approach course.