Apparent plane crash on TPC Scottsdale Golf Course

[rk911]

http://www.azfamily.com/story/37916578/apparent-plane-crash-on-tpc-scottsdale-golf-course

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

Just listened to the Scottsdale Tower frequencies on liveatc.net for that timeframe. Appears it was N9456P, with a registration pending to someone in Las Vegas. A PA24-260 from 1970. The certificate is now listed as "terminated or in question".

Some excerpts from the recording:

03:38:40Z Requests NW departure. Assigned runway 3.
03:44:04Z Cleared for takeoff
03:45:58Z Tower asks if experiencing any difficulty. Replies that "we're good"

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

FlightAware shows they had just flown down from North Las Vegas, landing at KSDL about 30 mins before this takeoff. The previous day to KTOA, Zamperini Field, in LA, though with no return flight plan.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

Curiously, the address listed for the registration in Las Vegas is sort of a half abandoned lot with a empty pool, etc. This is awful if a student pilot did this to his friends.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

Speculative of course, but cg aft of limits? The fact that the response on the radio mentions "training flight" would be consistent with a CFI being on board.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

Found this comment on FB courious:

Have to wonder if it is somehow related to the FAA listing its certificate as "terminated or in question". If they truly were flying a non-airworthy aircraft loaded aft of the CG limit -- wow, just wow.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

Instructor was Erik Kenneth Valente.

Relatively recent ATP:

Certificate: AIRLINE TRANSPORT PILOT
Date of Issue: 3/15/2018

Ratings:
AIRLINE TRANSPORT PILOT
AIRPLANE MULTIENGINE LAND
COMMERCIAL PRIVILEGES
AIRPLANE SINGLE ENGINE LAND

Type Ratings:
A/CE-500 A/EA-500 A/LR-60

Limits:
ENGLISH PROFICIENT.
EA-500 LR-60 SIC PRIVILEGES ONLY.

And flight instructor

Certificate: FLIGHT INSTRUCTOR
Date of Issue: 3/15/2018

Ratings:
FLIGHT INSTRUCTOR
AIRPLANE SINGLE AND MULTIENGINE
INSTRUMENT AIRPLANE


Limits:
VALID ONLY WHEN ACCOMPANIED BY PILOT CERTIFICATE NO. . EXPIRES: 30 JUN 2018.

Do we know where he trained and worked?

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

Appears to be pilot’s LinkedIn profile:

Experience

Ventures Inc.
Corporate pilot, Flight Department Co-Chief
Ventures Inc.
May 2014 – Present (4 years)

Cirrus Design Corporation
Contract Pilot
Cirrus Design Corporation
October 2011 – Present (6 years 7 months)

Memley Aviation, Inc.
Corporate Pilot
Memley Aviation, Inc.
February 2014 – August 2014 (7 months)

Elite Flight Training & Management
Chief Pilot
Elite Flight Training & Management
January 2010 – January 2014 (4 years 1 month)

College of Southern Nevada
Adjunct Faculty
College of Southern Nevada
August 2011 – January 2013 (1 year 6 months)

Education
The University of North Dakota
The University of North Dakota

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

Seems much too intelligent to stuff 6 people into that airplane...

It does seem very weird. Perhaps that is not actually his training - or he just didn’t think carefully about it that one time?

Also interesting that the tower had noticed something was off as well and called them.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

I don’t think there was enough time for them to see anything in flight, ask the question and have him respond as he did. Seems more likely he was still sitting at the south end of the runway, and explained the delay as “training”.

Interesting point. I think this raises the likelihood that it was some type of failure, at least somewhat.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

I can envisage a situation where one of the two pilots says, "hey, we're pilots and we have a plane," just to be cool. And someone then says, "hey, let's go to Vegas tonight and party."

Perhaps the same cognitive distortion, but they flew from Vegas to Scottsdale to pick people up and return to Vegas. They had arrived about 30 mins prior to departure.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

So a very slight tail-wind and wings rocking on take-off. Otherwise sounds like aft cg and a stall in the turn when it couldn’t climb.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

May also have been first night takeoff at an unfamiliar airport. It will be interesting to learn if he was night current.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

From the report it sounds like they have some video that should help understand the actual dynamics better.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

Another question: would the CFI even be aware that the student pilot was intoxicated by cocaine?

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

I must say, after watching the videos, I still don’t understand how the CFI allowed the plane to bank left and then just keep banking left like that. What the heck?

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

Maybe the CFI asked the student about doing W&B and the student lied, either embarrassed or knowing it failed, and the CFI took his word.

That’s a good point, the drug user would be much more likely to be confused and/or lie about the pre-flight items.

I suppose it was also possible the CFI was yelling at the student to level the wings and the drug impaired student just didn’t “get it” or respond as he normally had during lessons.

I also don’t think the student pilot was “holding out”. I think he just thought it was cool to go pick up the 3 models as dates.