Pattern Madness

[dmccormack]

So I'm flying with a new student -- hour 6 -- and we're doing the normal pattern entry. on a 45, closer to the upwind end of the runway, but fairly close, etc. Winds are light but favoring 28, all traffic that has landed in past 45 minutes has landed on 28.

He announced 3 miles from the field, entering the pattern, downwind for 28. I can hear other chatter on the radio but no airport ID -- just typical "Yeah, Jerry, I'm over here.." stupidity.

We're nearly abeam the numbers when I see a glint of silver ahead -- airplane, our altitude, right at us.

"My airplane."

I do a right turn out of the pattern (C150, so a right turn lets me keep an eye on him), and watch as hero does a steep 360 then heads for the upwind side. I also hear , "Yeah, uhh, gonna head over to upwind side.."

Again, no identifier, no nuthin.

I get us back on downwind and see it's a silver RV.

:mad2:

Now -- someone please tell me -- why, oh why is it always these blasted RV drivers who feel compelled to do overhead breaks over public use, busy GA fields?

I've yet to hear or see a Cessna or Piper or even Cirrus call "Overhead break" and ignore all pattern protocol (though I have had close calls with the same when they mis-called position, etc).

Also, the non-standard radio use, the complete disdain for other traffic seems unique among these wannabes. What am I missing?

 

[Jim Logajan]

So which "experimental" can I buy that has 4 seats 1000nm range, IFR certified GPS, 1250lbs useful load, and I can get used for $53,000?

I don't know what its range is, and the avionics may need to be added to, pushing it over the dollar amount, but there is this, which comes close and which took 2 minutes to find:

Velocity SE, asking price $47,000:

http://www.aso.com/listings/spec/ViewAd.aspx?id=125329&listingType=true&IsInternal=True&dealerid=

By the way, how many certified airplane models are there that are routinely available under $80,000 and less than 10 years old that cruise at 160 kts?

 

[Jim Logajan]

1000 = 1250 since when?

Now, lets add a 340, 430, HSI, Stormscope, and a second NAV radio and what does that come out to?

Beats me. You seem to be confusing the mission that the RV series address with the mission of whatever 90 year old model that you flies around at tortoise speed that you are using to make some uninteresting point.

 

[Jim Logajan]

Well, the E-A/B crowd always seems to tout themselves as the end-all-be-all and anyone else is insane for flying certified. I can't fit my dog in an RV3/4/6/7 safely, and he flies with me more often than not. Maybe an 8, but I don't like tandem seating. That leaves me with the RV-10 as pretty much my only legitimate E-A/B option. And those are waaaaaaaaaaaaay out of my price range. I can go through $100k of maintenance on the Comanche before I hit the break even point of buying an RV-10.

Fair enough. For its mission profile the RV seris are fine aircraft, hence their large numbers. For lots of missions they just wont do.

 

[Jim Logajan]

The overhead is supposed to be flown at the appropriate TPA with a level break to the downwind. No descent until passing the abeam position. At least, that's what it says in the Navy, Air Force, FAST and FFI manuals. The idea of flying the upwind leg 500 above TPA and doing a diving turn into the downwind is not to my knowledge part of any of those groups' procedures.

Unless I am misreading the procedure in the definition, it seems that 500 feet above TPA is how the FAA defines the usual approach for this maneuver; here is the text from the Pilot/Controller glossary:OVERHEAD MANEUVER- A series of predetermined maneuvers prescribed for aircraft (often in formation) for entry into the visual flight rules (VFR) traffic pattern and to proceed to a landing. An overhead maneuver is not an instrument flight rules (IFR) approach procedure. An aircraft executing an overhead maneuver is considered VFR and the IFR flight plan is cancelled when the aircraft reaches the "initial point" on the initial approach portion of the maneuver. The pattern usually specifies the following:
a. The radio contact required of the pilot.
b. The speed to be maintained.
c. An initial approach 3 to 5 miles in length.
d. An elliptical pattern consisting of two 180 degree turns.
e. A break point at which the first 180 degree turn is started.
f. The direction of turns.
g. Altitude (at least 500 feet above the conventional pattern).
h. A "Roll-out" on final approach not less than 1/4 mile from the landing threshold and not less than 300 feet above the ground.
Link:
http://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/publications/atpubs/PCG/O.HTM


Here is the information in the current AIM:5-4-27. Overhead Approach Maneuver a. Pilots operating in accordance with an IFR flight plan in Visual Meteorological Conditions (VMC) may request ATC authorization for an overhead maneuver. An overhead maneuver is not an instrument approach procedure. Overhead maneuver patterns are developed at airports where aircraft have an operational need to conduct the maneuver. An aircraft conducting an overhead maneuver is considered to be VFR and the IFR flight plan is cancelled when the aircraft reaches the initial point on the initial approach portion of the maneuver. (See FIG 5-4-30.) The existence of a standard overhead maneuver pattern does not eliminate the possible requirement for an aircraft to conform to conventional rectangular patterns if an overhead maneuver cannot be approved. Aircraft operating to an airport without a functioning control tower must initiate cancellation of an IFR flight plan prior to executing the overhead maneuver. Cancellation of the IFR flight plan must be accomplished after crossing the landing threshold on the initial portion of the maneuver or after landing. Controllers may authorize an overhead maneuver and issue the following to arriving aircraft:
1. Pattern altitude and direction of traffic. This information may be omitted if either is standard.
PHRASEOLOGY-
PATTERN ALTITUDE (altitude). RIGHT TURNS.
2. Request for a report on initial approach.
PHRASEOLOGY-
REPORT INITIAL.
3. “Break” information and a request for the pilot to report. The “Break Point” will be specified if nonstandard. Pilots may be requested to report “break” if required for traffic or other reasons.
PHRASEOLOGY-
BREAK AT (specified point).
REPORT BREAK.

Link: http://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/publications/atpubs/aim/Chap5/aim0504.html#Va821cROBE

 

[Jim Logajan]

(Maybe I should have waited for 500 messages to be posted before posting one with a definition of the maneuver mentioned by the OP. Sorry for posting it so early in the thread!)

 

[Jim Logajan]

These are usually done by high performance tactical jets whose recommended TPA is 500 above the "standard" TPA regardless of the entry, although they're still done with a level turn to downwind. If done in a light plane, entry at the regular light plane TPA is appropriate, and recommended by FAA-recognized civilian formation certification groups like FFI, although this should be coordinated with the tower at a towered airport.

The definition in the Pilot/Controller Glossary is vague on those sorts of details, so I could see civilian pilots filling in the gaps using their own judgements and still stay true to the glossary definition.

 

[Jim Logajan]

If anyone is interested, I did a search for "overhead break", "overhead maneuver", and "overhead approach" in the NTSB Database and found just the following 3 mid-air collisions:

http://dms.ntsb.gov/aviation/AccidentReports/lchyc145vrmxosmcyno1wx451/P08192011120000.pdf

http://www.ntsb.gov/aviationquery/brief.aspx?ev_id=20001207X03733&key=2

http://www.ntsb.gov/aviationquery/brief.aspx?ev_id=20030115X00072&key=2

 

[Jim Logajan]

I'm not making excuses for him, and I agree, he went off the deep end, it happens. He's very passionate about safety. Think of him as an old man with aviation as his lawn yelling at the kids to quit messin up his grass lol.