What's the mask/vaccine requirement situation in your area?

[cowman]

If you want to argue over what we should do please go elsewhere so this thread doesn't get locked. The purpose of this thread is for those of us traveling to get a handle on what to expect.

The question is what's the expectation on masks where you've been- not talking about ordinances or advisories, what do most people seem to be doing in practice and what are businesses requiring?

Across rural IL and MO where I spend most of my time it's mostly no-masks. A few places like Wal-Mart are recommending them but not enforcing and in some of those places you might see 1/3-1/2 of the people using them but you are able to go wherever you want without. I have never been asked if I'm vaccinated anywhere nor shown anyone proof of anything. The only places I've been to that require it are health care providers.

Would be very interested to hear from anyone who has been to the Bahamas lately as to how things are working there but I'm sure this info would be interesting/useful to others for all over.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

Arizona is a real mix right now. Governor is saying he will withhold funding from school districts that have mask mandates. Governor has order that municipalities cannot have mask mandates on private places or outdoors for mandates, though municipalities can require them in their buildings.

Most businesses no longer require but some, like Whole Foods say recommended or required for the unvaccinated, but no one is checking.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

Just in case I'm not around later, IBTL.

Is there a prize or something for the first IBTL when the thread ends up locked?

Or maybe we could run a pool on what post number it gets to before the lock?

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

None of it matters. We’re all going to get it, eventually.

Or some future variant which is much more contagious and much less dangerous. That is the normal course with these respiratory viral illnesses.

And IBTL

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

In any case, one either has a high risk of complications and/or some level of risk passing the disease to others. Don’t get me wrong: I don’t mask unless asked to, since I had the disease and got vaccinated. But blowing off the personal risk or risk to others is, well, inaccurate.

But what do you actually think is the risk to others of causing them serious harm?

It seems like a bunch of not terribly likely events have to happen:

Have to have the illness and be within the limited period of time when infectious.

Have to have enough contact with another, likely in an enclosed indoor space, to pass along a high enough dose of virions.

That person has to be infected by that dose.

That person has to have a serious bad outcome.

I’m not sure we have hard numbers on a lot of that.

We know the IFR of the original strain was about 0.25% overall. We know the period of infectivity is about 10-14 days.

Given those numbers, do you think the odds of causing serious harm to someone else, as an unvaccinated person and taking no other precautions, for the average person, are any greater than the sort of risks we subject others to all the time in day to day living? Like driving a car on the street.

I know I don’t think I can say with any real certainty that such a risk with Covid-19 is greater than the risk due to driving.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

Sure seems hospitals are pretty busy and ICUs are pretty full. Is that from driving accidents? I don’t think so…

Delta decided to increase their health insurance $200/mo for the unvaccinated. I don’t personally think that’s a political stunt any more than smoking increases the cost of life insurance. It’s actuarial.

OK - so the masks aren’t perfect and neither are the vaccines. Other than the adolescent ranting, what do those opposed to these scientifically substantiated tools suggest?

I am just talking about your comment about risk to others, not risk to self. Not sure the numbers in ICU beds or even the health insurance premiums argue too strongly to that one way or another - do they?

An increase in liability insurance rates for the unvaccinated would certainly argue to that point, but I am not aware of any such increases.

You are of course quite correct that the effectiveness of these interventions for preventing infection of the user is a statistical matter and they are hardly either 100% or 0% effective. The numbers fall into a range that the average person has a hard time reasoning about - thus all the ridiculous arguments which are essentially the equivalent of people arguing “that color is black, black I tell you” , “no it’s not, it’s clearly white”, when the real answer is that the color is 73% grey.

In any case, your comment and this sub thread stray seriously from the original points here and into territory which is no longer permitted as a discussion point on PoA. So if you want to discuss with me further, I am all ears via PM. I leave it at that.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

(This is not addressed to any specific person.) Whatever your personal and political views about masks, vaccines, etc, don't forget to be kind and civil. There's no need to try to prove a point with everything you do in.

True in those places where masks, vaccines, whatever are voluntary and not government mandates.

If the latter I say resist this imposition at every opportunity where it is safe to do so.

And in Arizona no mandates, except in government buildings, so we don’t need to worry about it much here.