Getting the shaft, need help wrapping up PPL

[Jamie Kirk]

Here is a long story but I’ll cliff note it at the end for those TLDR.

Started flying with a local school in August 2018 and right before I was signed off to solo at 14 hours I lost my CFI as he got very ill and was out for 6-8 weeks. During that time the school had no plan, kept me flying with different instructors 2-3x a week and I wish I knew then what I knew now but I basically threw thousands away.

When my CFI came back in January I was over 50 in hours and he was thinking we will be doing checkride prep. Nope, I haven’t even soloed and done nothing but pattern work for 50 hours. No XC, no night, no simulated instrument and ZERO ground work.

So in January I actually start being a student and not just an ATM for the school. CFI tried to rush me to be checkride ready in weeks, wasn’t possible. And then he had to have an operation which took him out again. A new CFI stepped in and he had a plan and got me scheduled with a checkride in February.

For the checkride it ended in a continuance. This was in mid February and now it turns to crap. Due to weather, work and the DPE it keeps getting pushed back. DPE is scheduled for a procedure mid March and will be out 2 weeks, not acceptable to me. It’s costing me over $1,000 a week to stay at the top of my skill, I decide to personally reach out to other DPEs and schools to wrap this up.

Apparently this is the worst thing anyone can do. I called a few schools who then gave me DPE contact info and I reached out to them. Told the DPEs my circumstances and about the continuance and they asked for my FTN number which I sent over. One of the DPEs reached out to my original DPEs because the paperwork didn’t make sense. Now apparently I stirred the hornets nest.

Original DPE filled out the continuance wrong, he marked items completed that were not complete. According to the continuance I successfully passed the checkride which confused the other DPE which now made the original DPE have a talk with his FSDO about his paperwork. He then called the school which then contacted me.

School said it was against their policy for me to check with another DPE about a checkride without their approval. They only allow 2 DPEs for students to use. Now the DPE is very upset because his paperwork error was made aware to the FSDO so he light a fire with the school. The school told me now that basically I’m done, can’t fly with them anymore and the DPE won’t finish my checkride. He has also since gone into IACRA and completely edited my continuance, what I was given as recent does not match what I was given on the date of my continuance.

Called other DPE, he won’t help either. Apparently I upset the secret good ol boys club. Wonderful.

So here I am, 80 hours in with no school and no DPE and a continuance that expires and all my endorsements expire within 2 weeks.

Cliff notes:
Started training for PPL
Lost CFI
School has no plan and waste my time and money
Finally get checkride which ends in continuance
DPE filled out checkride paperwork wrong
FSDO finds out
DPE and school shun me
I’m all alone

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

One thing about me is I am a very nice guy and will bend over backwards for people. But I am a horrible enemy. I have been in the legal profession for 13 years, I don't let people screw me.

This is a really awful story and sorry to hear about it. I bailed early on a problematic school/bought my own plane, so avoided a saga quite this painful.

Is it correct that the solution is set up now? That is the important thing. If you are coming to Phoenix, let us know as there are a number of PoA people here and it would be fun to get together. Will also help if you want and are doing the training here.

If in the legal profession, why not finish the PP then start the gradual process of taking them to court if needed. What would the claims be? As you know, the well reasoned letter is a good start on that process. If there are some plausible claims, then hit them with an order to preserve evidence after the PP is done.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

The issue is this can turn intoa much larger issue for the school and others.

If there is something crooked going on there, it would definitely be a service to the community to let a little sunshine in. Completely agree that just finish your own certificate first. Should be more fun in your own plane. Once you are endorsed for solo in it, you can then just fly when you want without worrying about scheduling at the FBO (of course, you then have to wait for your own plane's MX ;-)

CFIs as independent contractors? Won't pass the sniff test with the CA DOL.

Yes, depends a lot on whether the CFIs are working at the direction of the school on their property. That usually won't fly for an independent contractor arrangement.

Checkride costing more than the local average? Does the CFI or school get a portion of it? IF so what are the FAA regulations on that?

Sounds like could be a fraud claim. One would have to wonder about the objectivity of the examination.

First subpoena of records would be so overwhelming and being a corporation they would need to hire an attorney to represent them.

Just the demand for preservation of evidence should give them a bit of work and probably need to go to an attorney.

I wonder if you can get a substantial portion of your fees refunded with the properly written and well reasoned letter.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

So $14,160 / $250 per hour = 56 hours. About half the national average for part 61 and less than the average for part 141. If true, that sounds like this is frustrating, but not completely out of line.

 

[PeterNSteinmetz]

I have 79 hours with the school.

Well sound considerably less than average for part 61 and perhaps a bit over for part 141 (don’t recall if the school was part 141 or not). Anyway, sounds like you have a good setup now with your own plane. Enjoy the freedom :emoji846: